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[X]Outlaw

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#1
They are finally here!!!! :D

I place an order with Matt for these two machines late December 2016 and finally had them delivered to me last Thursday. Their trip was long (Taiwan-->USA-->Trinidad and Tobago) but they arrived in perfect condition.

The service I received from QMT was great. Matt was always very helpful and always replied to emails in a timely manner. I would not hesitate to recommend them to anyone.

Mark Jacobs was also very, very, VERY helpful in helping me understand everything involved in 3PH electrical setup. I am lucky enough to have one of his control systems for my lathe and I really appreciate all his help. I will be documenting the build of my VFD enclosure as well as the installation of Mark's control system in this thread as well.

I spent Thursday afternoon getting the machines moved to the back of my place, a task that was made easier by using a skid steer that my wife got borrowed for me from her work. Friday morning was spend getting them moved into the shop with a couple of pallet jacks. This went fairly smoothly and the only thing extra I had to do was remove the handles and lead screw from the Mill's table to get some additional clearance though the door.

After I got everything inventoried I started cleaning up the lathe. The finish on these machines are very very nice. The mill is beautiful!

I'm Hoping to get the Mill off the pallet and put in place weekend.

I'll document my setup progress on this thread. Hopefully it would be helpful to anyone considering any of these machines.

Looking forward to making some good parts with them in the coming months :)

Chevy





 

brino

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#3
You're gonna have some fun.
Congratulations!

-brino
 

Alan H

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#7
Chevy, Congratulations on two very nice machines. You are off to the races now! Hope your budget is plush for all the tooling you will now be buying!

You are wise person to acquire a Mark Jacobs control system for your lathe. His system is top shelf and so is his help! The combination of a good lathe and Mark's system aboard make for a very nice machine indeed.

Looking forward to following your progress here.
 

wrmiller

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#8
Congratulations! I'll go get the popcorn and wait for the show. We need lots of pictures of course. :D
 

bss1

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#9
This is definitely the most interesting color scheme for a machine shop yet! Love the lavender and sea green! All kidding aside, congrats on the new machines!
 

[X]Outlaw

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#11
Allan the budget for tooling is always an ongoing thing lol! I remember when I first got my Taig CNC mill everyone told me you're going to spend way more money on the tooling than the machine itself...truer words have never been spoken! This time I set aside a good bit for some nice tooling to start with.

wrmillewr I'll post lots of pictures as I start to put everything together (power distribution, VFD, DROs, Powerfeed etc) . This forum has been a huge resource for me when I was looking for information on these machines, I' hoping to give back something.

bss1 what can I say, I love color. I just couldn't bring myself to have a grey floor lol! I chose colors that would be relaxing on my eyes since I'm going to be spending a lot of time in the shop.

Chevy
 

[X]Outlaw

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#12
A little update for you guys.

This past weekend I was hoping to get both machines off their pallets and put into final position in the shop. This turned into quite the adventure!

Getting the mill put in place was my real priority. So my dad and a friend of mine started early Saturday morning. we cut the pallet to size for the legs of the engine crane to fit around. The engine crane we used did not have the legs angled out like most currently on the market. Instead the legs were parallel to each other and can be extended out. This allowed us to get up really close from behind the machine with what was left of the pallet fitting perfectly inside the legs of the crane. It was looking like this was going to be a walk in the park...yea right! By the time we got the arm of the crane to the height were we could hook the two straps placed under the ram, the crane maxed out on travel!

So then I thought to myself...hey maybe another crane might have just a little more reach. Called up a buddy, he said to check him in a couple hours. So while waiting we focused our energies on getting the lathe mounted and in place. Which we did with no trouble to talk about. The only thing worth mentioning is that all of the six holes on the lathe lined up with the ones in the cabinets.....except one. The front inboard hole on the head stock side. No amount of wiggling or shifting got us the few mm we needed on that one hole. This isn't a huge issue, later in the week I'll just take a rotary tool and grind of the little bit of clearance that's needed working from inside/under the cabinet.

Having gotten the lathe mounted and feeling the first sense of accomplishment for the day we hopped in the wife's car and she drove us about an hour to my buddy's place to borrow his crane. However when we got back to my shop we realized because the legs in his crane are angled we can't get it to slide up to the mill. So in our moment of despair my buddy was like...why don't we exchange the cylinders out between the cranes...hey it was worth a try right? lol. Needless to say that didn't make a difference.

By this time it was pretty late and we were pretty much beat so we decided to call it a day. We talked about possible solutions to this problem on Sunday morning and formulated out next plan of attack. We're going to try to find a suitable "A" frame gantry crane that can fit in my shop. If we can't find one to borrow or rent by mid week we're going to build one out of 4x4 lumber and use a 2ton chain hoist on it. Either solution would make moving the mill short work.

I will defiantly take pictures of the setup and if we decide to go the build route I'll take pics of the build.

I leave you guys with our one win over the weekend. The lathe mounted with a preliminary clean up.

Chevy





 

Silverbullet

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#14
If you build a gantry crane to pick it up why not keep it built to pick things up to your mill. Rotary tables , vises, dividing heads, come to mind even chucks for the lathe. Believe me you will need it again , I'm or was a very strong man used to two hundred pounds daily at times all day long lifting moving machining and repeat. But now I'm unable to lift five pounds without pain. My cranes and lift tables have kept me being able to do things. I'm still planning on a large gantry in front of my shop, maybe even a small one in the shop , that may not be needed if my rolling shelf lift works out I have a 36" actuator with over 300 lbs push and pull I'm planning on mounting on the off corner of the shelf unit I built should work , with the counter balance of vises ,rotary table and mag drill on bottom. A swivel jib on top with straps and hook will lift and move. Nice machines I only dream of things like those. Good luck and hi I'm SILVERBULLET
 

[X]Outlaw

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#15
Hey Silverbullet, the usefulness of a crane in the shop has not illuded me. Even before I realised that I would need a gantry to lift this mill I had plans to make a small crane specifically to lift all the tools you listed, especially the rotary table and dividing head.

I'm coming from a miniature world (Taig and Sherline machines) where chucks, vises, rotary table, even an entire lathe can be lifted with little effort. I knew when getting into full sized machines that I would need some assist in lifting equipment, plus almost everyone told me something along on lines of "You won't be young forever and your back will thanks you later in life".

The gantry we're going to build will be all bolted together so most likely it would be taken apart and stored for future use. However I still have a good bit of equipment to be moved into my shop (CNC mill, CNC lathe, TIG welding equipment, welding table, tool boxes etc.). So space is a bit of a premium. So I'll store the gantry crane in a dismantled state but I am going to build a small crane with casters and a winch for lifting chucks, rotary table, dividing heads etc.

I'll have quite a few projects that I would like to complete before the end of the year for the shop. Top of that list is a belt grinder and that small crane.

Oh and sorry for the fuzzy pics guys, I only realised this morning my phone camera was set to a low quality. I'll have better pics next time.

Chevy
 

[X]Outlaw

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#16
So guys I'm ecstatic to say that we got the mill safely off the pallet and put in place this weekend :grin::grin:

It took five of us (My Dad, three friends and myself) about 4 hours working very slowly to get this thing down safely. We ended up using a 3 Ton engine hoist that had more travel and reach than the more common 2 Ton engine hoist. Many thanks to my friend Trevor for getting this borrowed from the factory he works at.

I could see why a lot of guys go with the smaller PM935. That said, I am very glad I went with the bigger machine despite the hurdle of moving it.

Sunday morning I managed to reinstall the X axis lead screw and handles as they were removed to get her through the door way. Then I took my time and gave her a good clean up. All the precision surfaces we perfect with zero scratches or cosmetic defects of any kind. All axis moved smooth as silk which put a huge smile on my face.

The only thing I really didn't like was the crank handle for the knee. The one that came with the machine was kinda rough and really didn't go with how nice the rest of the machine is so I got a nice polished chrome one from ebay for $30.

Next order of business is getting these two machines wired up for power, then unto DRO installation. Meanwhile I've started aquiering tooling and work holding items. I went with a Kurt DX6 for the mill and a Dorian BXA QCTP for the lathe.

I am leaning towards ER32 tool holding for the mill over R8 but I haven't decided yet.

Here's a few pics of the mill all cleaned up.

Chevy





 

Rich V

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#17
Nice setup mannnn (said in Bob Marley's voice :))

I have the same lathe & mill - great choices.
For the mill I use both the ER32 collets and R8. The ER collets are very useful since a set will cover everything from 0.02 - 0.787 inches so you can cover the full range of tooling commonly used in a mill of this size. The R8 collets are useful as they present a shorter (and hence stiffer) tool holding option and they can be had cheaply.
If you are looking for some indexable lathe tool holders I purchased this set https://www.amazon.com/Accusize-Indexable-Carbide-Turning-2387-2005/dp/B01MSBL5Y8/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1497370804&sr=8-1-fkmr1&keywords=7+Pc+5/8''+Indexable+Carbide+Turning+Lathe+Tool+Set and I'm very happy with them.

This site is a wealth of knowledge for us hobbyists with some amazingly generous people willing to help and answer our questions. Good luck in your quest for a quality home shop.
Rich
 
Last edited:

mksj

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#18
Machines look great!

Similar comments as Rich mentioned. You most likely want both, but there are a few other options to also consider. Part of this will depend if you are using a power drawbar or not. On my old mill without a power drawbar, I used an ER32 system most of the time as it has very low TIR and was quicker for me. Rigidity wise, I think you would not notice the difference. On my new mill with a power drawbar, I almost exclusively use R8 collets and R8 integrated shank tooling. I do have an ER40 setup with a set of 1/32 collets (gives a tighter overlap as opposed to 1 mm increments), this allows the ability to hold 1" end mills and I also have a MT3 for the lathe tailstock. I often used an end mill in the tailstock to square up the base of a hole. The ER40 is definitely bigger, so not so good for smaller stuff if used on the mill. In most cases with end mills used with an R8 collet, the end mills have fixed sized shanks so something like a 1/8" set will cover about everything or consider getting a few better collets for the most common sizes used. I have not had good success with the quality of some of the generic Chinese R8 collets, and recently replaced a few from Shar's that had too much runout. Vertex is Taiwanese, and they may be a bit better, otherwise you might consider Lyndex or Crawford if you can get them at a reasonable price. A few of us have purchased the Crawford R8 collets from Rotagrip and they are great, but they are no longer in production.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VERTEX-R8-R...1-8-to-3-4-for-Bridgeport-Mills-/231863951469
http://www.rotagriponline.com/index...tegory_id=324&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=29
http://www.rotagriponline.com/index...tegory_id=324&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=29
http://www.ebay.com/itm/R8-CRAWFORD...869263?hash=item1c59fd7d8f:g:1L8AAOSwiLdWAvY~
http://www.ebay.com/itm/R8-CRAWFORD...291589?hash=item1c59f4ad05:g:1L8AAOSwiLdWAvY~

A few people use a quick change R8 setup, only reasonable if you purchase it from the UK as it is 2-3X more expensive from US distributors.
http://www.rotagriponline.com/index...rt&page=shop.browse&category_id=173&Itemid=29
 

wrmiller

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#19
[X]Outlaw: Enjoy the new machines!

While in Co I had the chance to buy a very large Lagun at a real good price. But at over 3500 lbs. It would have cost 3-4 times the cost of the mill to get it moved to AZ. Ouch! I'll just have to suffer with my little 935. It as done everything I've asked of it so far. :D

FYI, I have Vertex collets and they are pretty decent quality at a reasonable price. And a ER32 holder for spinning real small cutters and burrs when working on tiny stuff.
 

[X]Outlaw

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#20
Mark, those two reasons are exactly why I've been cosidering the ER32 system, very low TIR and I most likely wont be using a powerdraw bar. At least not in the immediate future.

Bill, thanks for chiming in about the Vertex collets. I will also get a set of R8 collets (Vertex) for any occasion where clearance with a ER32 chuck would be an issue.

Rich, I'll add those tool holder you've recommended to a few other sets I'm evaluating. Oh...and IIMON! lol!
 

[X]Outlaw

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#23
Hopefully this weekend I'll get all my other equipment moved into the shop. Last weekend we were preparing for a tropical storm (Bret) that hit us around Monday night. Very thankfully to say our area (North East) didn't sustain any notable damage, the south of the island suffered some major flooding however, hopefully the waters will subside soon. We are forecast to have more bad weather this weekend. I had to turn back from going to work this morning (Central part of the island) because the Caroni River (our main river) overflowed onto the Hi-way, spent two hours in traffic before deciding to work from home.

I did manage to install an Align 500P powerfeed on my X axis. Though it was pretty straight forward here are some things to keep in mind if this is your first install as it was mine.

1. There is a little steel bushing that slides onto the lead screw. At first this part was very tight fitting and I thought I would have to polish out the ID with some emery paper. Before I committed to that idea I measured the lead screw OD and the bushing ID and there was enough clearance for a nice slip fit. When I took a closer look at what was happening I found that the bushing was actually catching on the chamfer on that part of the lead screw. A very light pass with a stone on the chamfer and the bushing slipped right on.

2. Take your time and set the correct backlash with the bevel gear, it takes a fair amount of trial and error. Assemble everything and make sure it turns smooth with the hand crank. I ended up with one 2mm and one 1mm shim to get it nice and smooth.

3. When everything is setup and you test your new powerfeed, that loud click sound you here when you shift from neutral to your desired direction in normal. This is the clutch engaging. Now I did think that the sound was the clutch engaging but I didn't know if it was normal for it to make such a sound. I spend a couple hours searching online to find and answer to this till I gave up and emailed Mark and Bestline. The both told me the sound was normal. Believe it or not..this is way took up most of my time as I thought I installed something incorrectly lol.

This week I've been working on the general layout for my VFD enclosures and have it more of less finalised. Once my wire ferrules and termination ends come in tomorrow I'll be able to get to work.

Chevy
 

Kiwi Canuck

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#24
Outlaw, nice machines and thanks for showing them off.

Hopefully you are far enough South East to have missed most of Irma and you and your family are safe.

Was in Trinidad & Tobago on my way to sailing in BVI recently, very nice people around those parts.

Be well and give us an update when you can.

David.
 

[X]Outlaw

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#25
Hey David,

Thanks for the thoughts. Thankfully we are far enough south not to west to have Irma miss us completely, so we're ok. I do feel it for the islands that did get hit, especially Barbuda and Antigua. The pictures I've seen from the damage in Barbuda is truly heart breaking. Hopefully the other CARICOM countries will send aid to help the get back on their feet. I also hope by some miracle Florida is spared. I don't think I recall any past years where there was this much intense activity.

Talking about sailing and BVI, I saw pics of the damage done to scores of sail boats there because of Irma. Hoped you enjoyed your stay in my Country :)

A little update on the shop. Most of my equipment has been moved in except for my CNC mill. I have finished my VFD, power distribution and control system for the mill. I ran her motor up for the first time a couple weekends ago and everything worked great. Big thanks to Mark for all his help! This weekend I'm finishing up machining the mounting bracket that attaches the switch control box to the knee of the mill and hooking it up to the VFD.

I will post a detailed write up about my VFD and control system installation next week with lots of pics.

This is the current state of the shop thus far :D



Chevy
 

Rich V

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#26
Great looking shop!
Glad to hear that nasty lady didn't drop by for a visit.
 

Bob La Londe

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#27
If you build a gantry crane to pick it up why not keep it built to pick things up to your mill. Rotary tables , vises, dividing heads, come to mind even chucks for the lathe. Believe me you will need it again , I'm or was a very strong man used to two hundred pounds daily at times all day long lifting moving machining and repeat. But now I'm unable to lift five pounds without pain. My cranes and lift tables have kept me being able to do things. I'm still planning on a large gantry in front of my shop, maybe even a small one in the shop , that may not be needed if my rolling shelf lift works out I have a 36" actuator with over 300 lbs push and pull I'm planning on mounting on the off corner of the shelf unit I built should work , with the counter balance of vises ,rotary table and mag drill on bottom. A swivel jib on top with straps and hook will lift and move. Nice machines I only dream of things like those. Good luck and hi I'm SILVERBULLET
I friend of mine recently gave me an old chair lift for an electric wheel chair. My plan is to mount it to a heavy tool cart so I can use it to swing vises on and off my mills. Just clamp the buckle in the vise and go. I can easily lift the vises I have. The two biggest ones I have (8 inch) only about 100 lbs, but lifting and leaning in over a table to set it in place is something I can feel pulling in my back. I've done it a few times, but I know if I keep doing it I'll damage something. One bed mill I have with an enclosure requires a real long reach in to set a vise on the table. The arm on the chair lift would reach right in there. It would be kind of like a pickup bed crane, but with an electric winch instead of a hand crank.
 

[X]Outlaw

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#28
Hey guys,

So here's where I'm at in getting my machines up and running. So far all my efforts have been focused on the mill. Besides cleanup and leveling I haven't done anything with the lathe yet. Hopefully I should be able to start working on her later this month.

This is the VFD and power distribution system I built (Many thanks to Mark for his wiring diagrams). Apart from powering the VFD it provides 12V and 24V DC power for devices such as work lights, tachometer solenoids and relays. It also supplies 120v to the DRO and powerfeeds. This way all equipment for the machine is powered on or off with one switch.



The motor on this machine is a two speed, 3ph, 3HP, constant HP. Below is the motor name plate showing the wiring diagram for the two speeds. I opted to wire it on the low speed side (4(8)P) this way you get double the torque on the low end. For top end speed I would run the VFD between 60-100Hz. On the highest pulley @ 100Hz I should get a top speed of ~4500RPM.



When I opened the motor wiring box I realized that the entry hole for the motor wires had a sharp edge to it. So I took out the box filed the edges of the hole then used some fuel tubing to make a grommet so that the wires have zero change of coming in contact with any sharp edges.



Motor wire up in 4(8)P configuration. For motor to VFD I used 14 AWG shielded VFD cable that has both a braided shield as well as a drain wire.



Wiring for my control box. I should have really used a 9 conductor cable for this but I couldn't find any at a reasonable price. I had a good supply of shielded 3 and 2 conductor cable from previous projects so I opted to make use of those.



Now I bought legend plates for the direction switch as well as the speed pot. However when I installed them they looked..well I didn't like how they looked lol. So I decided to design and make my own :D Below is my Taig CNC mill engraving my legend plate. I didn't have the proper V bit on hand so I just used my smallest spot drill and tested at different DOC till the engraving looked right.



Finished plate





I knew from the start I wanted the controls mounted to the knee in front the machine. I don't like (read loathe) drilling holes into machines unless its absolutely necessary such as mounting DRO scales. So I designed and machined a mount for the control box that utilizes the existing M8 bolts on the Y Axis end plate.

Top to bottom:

1. Switch box mounting plate. The slots cut in it are for 1/2" velcro straps for some cable management.
2. Bracket that mounts to the Y axis end plate
3. Extension that connects the Bracket and the mounting plate together. These two parts could have really been made as one but the Taig mill doesn't have that amount of travel and more importantly I just didn't want to machine one half, index and then machine the second out of one piece of stock.
4. This is an isolator made out of some scrap .062" engraving plastic. The Y axis end plate is aluminum and I wanted to prevent any chance of it galling when the mounting bracket is bolted on top of it.



Switch box mount assembled



Cable straps



So that's where I'm at. This week I hope to wire up the controls to the VFD and make the mount for the E-Stop switch which will go on the head, where the stock switch was located.

Chevy
 
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