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PM-1440GS or PM1340GT lathe or maybe a PM1440GT

Discussion in 'PRECISION-MATTHEWS' started by jer, Apr 6, 2017.

  1. chargerman111

    chargerman111 United States Iron Registered Member

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    I have the PM1440E-LB and I Almost bought the Grizzly G0709, I am glad I didn,t. Just my opinion but I believe I got more for the $ with precision Mathews. I know the machines are simular but I got the 2"large bore spindle with the larger spindle bearings,3hp motor, MT4 tailstock. Mine is almost identical to the GS. If you want to do a video call with me I can go over it with you and show you anything you want to see. I love it and Matt is great to deal with. Just message me if you want to see it.

    Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
     
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  2. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks guys for all the info. If I can swing it I will get the PM1440GT with 3 phase (to save cost and setup time). I will do a VFD conversion right from the start. If the GT doesn't work out I will get the GS and convert it ASAP.

    Mark and Jay I hope I'm smart enough to do the VFD conversion but think it is worth the time. The reason I wanted to use a Lenze is because I have one on my mill, I work under the KISS principal. I can use a Hitachi if needed.

    Also I have talked with Matt concerning tooling etc.

    Thanks again all.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  3. jbolt

    jbolt United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    You will have no problem putting it together. There is plenty of support here to get through it. Once you do one you will realize it's not that hard.
     
  4. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Hi Jay, I did the basic programing on my mill with a 3 hp Lenze SMVector as mentioned above. Until I move into my new "project shop" I didn't take full advantage of its many features. If the Lenze is too much problem I will go with a Hitachi.
     
  5. mksj

    mksj Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Each VFD has there own quarks and programming tweaks. If you are going to do the basic install, most newer sensorless vector VFDs will work. But if you plan on doing a more full system, then it matters as there are different wiring and programming parameters that vary by VFD brand/type.
     
  6. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Mark, in your opinion, should I place a premium on using another Lenze on the lathe to keep my learning curve simpler on me (KISS)? I can go with a Hitachi if need be. I don't want to impose on your knowledge to an unreasonable degree? I like that they are made in the USA too. My plans are to get it going with the basics at first and let it evolve as needed.

    Also is the base steel or cast iron on the GT model?
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  7. dpb

    dpb United States H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    The base on mine is ~3/16" steel. I haven't experienced any lack of stability or rigidity.
     
    jer likes this.
  8. jbolt

    jbolt United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    The steel stand on the GT is very stout. I had my concerns at first but Matt has done a good job on the specs to the manufacturer to get it very ridgid.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk
     
    jer likes this.
  9. mksj

    mksj Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I would stick with the WJ200, they have been very reliable and everything has been worked out on them for these machines. You also save some $. There are a lot of good VFDs, and a few crappy ones. But in this case since the majority of the VFD conversions for the 1340/1440GT have been with the WJ200 it is a known quantity. Not a problem to help whatever you decide. I would not get too hung up a cast iron base, everything I have read is the 1440GT is very stout, it is also the mass of the machine. Based on your discussions I would stick with either of the 1440GT or GS, I sometime wish for a bit more mass on my lathe, a pull out chip tray and a larger spindle bore. So pretty much what you are looking for.
    Mark
     
  10. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks Mark, I have been reading many VFD threads you have done. I'm not sure just yet exactly what features I want but so far I think I want; for/rev, speed pot, accel control, decel control, and may want VFD braking.

    I will add to this as possibilities come to mind. I hope this doesn't get too complicated for my pea brain. LOL.

    Perhaps a proximity sensor?
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2017
  11. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Well all, the deed is done. I have a PM1440GT 3 phase on order, with a bunch of goodies to go with it. Talk about blowing your budget, I doubled it. LOL. Oh, they are in stock too! My wait won't be long this time.

    Now all I need is to impose on a few of our very knowledgeable members for guidance. I have some parts to gather and a lot to learn.
     
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  12. jbolt

    jbolt United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    :dancing banana: Awesome! You won't be disappointed.

    Any time you need help spending more money we're her for ya!
     
  13. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks Jay, I appreciate you guys helping me go $4K over my already raised budget. I don't deserve such a fine machine, but I'll get over it. LOL.

    I picked up a 12" j&p box for the lathe and a 10" one for the mill this morning. That's a start. I will need guidance with what I need for the controls I want. Which look to be forward/reverse, speed pot, tach, accel control, decel control, perhaps a proximity sensor & bypass and may want VFD braking. Any thoughts on the matter?

    I'm thinking the tach and speed pot in a box under the DRO, like the pictures of tachs I've seen.

    Thanks again.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2017
  14. jbolt

    jbolt United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I have electronic and mechanical braking.

    Mine is setup with 2-speed braking via a switch. One setting is for 1-2 seconds for spindle speeds 1K or less and the other is set for 3-4 seconds is for above 1k rpm with a heavy chuck. I need to up the deceleration time on the high end as it will fault sometimes.

    In reality I keep the braking set at the first setting (1-2 seconds) and use the mechanical brake for high speed. Electronic braking from high speed with a large chuck is not quick enough in some situations and if it faults it will free wheel. The mechanical brake has saved my bacon a few times where I'm not sure the electronic would have but I have a habit of turning at higher speeds than most.

    I setup mine with the proximity stop but never use it and find it gets in the way so I have it disabled. I know others like them for threading up to a shoulder but I have no trouble without. YMMV.

    Just in case you have any $$$$ left over may I recommend the http://www.ajaxtoolsupply.com/pba86jawsela.html :grin: (yeah I want one too)
     
  15. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    COUGH... COUGH... CHOKE... CHOKE... I have PM "High Precision" 8" 3J and 4J Taiwanese chucks coming with the lathe. I would love to have a 5C chuck too but maybe later.

    I might use electronic braking at threading speeds and mechanical over that, or just mechanical for everything. How does that sound? I don't want to get too technical.
     
  16. jbolt

    jbolt United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    We will expect a full review on the chucks.

    I opted not to get the Chucks from Matt. I got a Gator 8" 3-jaw adjustable and a Gator 8" 4-jaw with two piece jaws so I could use soft jaws.

    I just did a job in 2" Aluminum thin wall tubing (.o35" wall) that had internal snap ring grooves. A 6-jaw would have been nice to have.
     
  17. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    The PM 8" 3J has two piece jaws but the 4J has reversible jaws (two piece would be nice). I hope "High Precision" means high quality.
     
  18. dpb

    dpb United States H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    The 8" 3 jaw I bought from PM as part of the upgrade package holds less than .001" TIR on anything I've tried it on so far.
     
    jer likes this.
  19. Doubleeboy

    Doubleeboy Active User Active Member

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    Nice looking lathe, congrats! You can take the drama out of threading to a shoulder by turning tool upside down and threading in reverse moving towards tailstock. Sure makes life easy, no crashes, no worries. Joe P on you tube has video on it, highly recommended if you are not already aware of the specifics.
     
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  20. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks guys. I hope my chuck is as accurate. I had seen Joe do that come to think about it.
     
  21. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Hi Mark, I could send you a PM but I'm sure there are others that would be interested in the info too. The PM1440GT being so new it is still somewhat an unknown.

    I picked up 12" and 10" j&p boxes, if needed, Tuesday. The price was right, free.

    I'm looking for guidance with what I need for the controls I want, and the level of complexity. Which look to be forward/reverse, speed pot, tach, accel control (as in 3-5 seconds), decel control (2-3 sec.), upper and lower freq. as in 30 to 90 cycles. Perhaps a proximity sensor & bypass and may want VFD foot braking (as in "OH SH$T" right now). I'm thinking tach and speed pot in a small box under the DRO display.

    What does that sound like to you? I can live without the P sensor and/or VFD foot brake if it is too complicated. I think the rest shouldn't be too much for my limited ability. (Maybe).
     
  22. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    The GT will be here next Friday. :big grin:

    Now if I just knew all it takes to make it run. LOL. :eek 3:

    It will take a little while to clean it up and install the DRO and VFD. The electronics will be the hardest thing for me. :confused:

    Thanks for all your help guys. :applause 2:
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
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  23. mksj

    mksj Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Jerry,
    I would send me a PM with your email and we can see what you want to do. There are a number of different build possibilities, and every one is different. What I recommend is a basic setup using the contactors to activated the VFD inputs to get you started. You can get most of the features you are asking about, but the proximity sensor and some of the more advance interlocks/controls requires a new system build either on the current control board or a new drop in replacement. You will also need to map out all the wiring and you would need a new wiring harness and front panel switches. Doable, but probably takes 2-3 weeks to get it all together depending on available time. A known VFD system build takes me about 16-20 hours to put together. Maybe JBOLT can provide some information on the foot brake dual pole limit switch he used. I think if you have a mechanical foot brake, then probably a good safety feature in addition to the normal VFD braking, but the VFD needs to have a freewheel command. You will need a VFD braking resistor, these are suggestions:
    https://www.digikey.com/product-det...passive-product/TJT50047RJ/A123924-ND/5878245
    https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ohmite/WFH330L50RJE/WFH330L50RJE-ND/824606
    http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Ohmite/WFH330L50RJE

    I already have programming parameters for the 1440GT basic conversion, the WJ200 is fairly straight forward to program once you get your hands on it. The enclosure must be at leas 8" deep, the resistors are are 11-13" long, a 12x12" box you may be limited to the Ohmite, as the TE is 13".
    Regards,
    mark
     
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  24. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks Mark, I will be getting with you soon. I'm good with the basic setup, maybe for ever. It seems simple, quick and little cost involved. Which after the lathe will keep my "Financial Officer" happy.

    I saw your programing on the 1340GT, it looked good. Similar to my Lenze VFD on my mill.

    Also the boxes I have are only 6" deep so they won't work.

    I expect the conversion will take me a few weeks to learn and gather items needed.

    Thanks again Mark.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
  25. sanddan

    sanddan Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I watched one of his videos where he was doing an internal thread using this technic and running the lathe very fast. Very impressive! He does a great job with his videos.
     
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  26. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks Mark, I sent a PM but not sure if it got to you. Thanks for all the info I'm sure I will do a better job with your help.
     
  27. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Mark/Jay, does the 1440GT have a main rotary switch on it for on/off, or any main?

    Do you by any chance have a schematic for it? I need to start getting familiar with my new machine and its wiring.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  28. mksj

    mksj Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Hi Jay,
    It does not have a rotary power disconnect switch, you could add one either at the machine or at the VFD enclosure. There is also enough room in the headstock cabinet to mount the VFD in the cabinet. I have a schematic, but not sure it is going to help but I can send it to you. It also seems that there is a wide variation in how they are wired and components, so it may be worthwhile see how your shows up. I did get your PM and sent you additional information.
    Mark.
     
  29. jer

    jer Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks Mark, I will try to send pictures of the wiring when the GT gets here, they say Friday. I appreciate our help. I will start gathering parts after I/we decide what functions are the best for my needs. I got your email. Thanks again.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  30. jbolt

    jbolt United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I used a Honeywell GLEA24C micro switch though I don't know what is micro about it. Installation requires drilling two new mounting holes in the base.
     

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