Newbie: Need Help Setting Up Overhead Ram Support Van Norman 16 Mill

[Bob V]

Hi,
I'm new to milling-- have done some car/truck/farm repairs-- but just bought a Van Norman 16 mill last April and am finally getting around to getting it going and have made a few chips.
I'm trying to figure out how to set up the overhead ram support for horizontal milling:
--The picture shows the "Pilot-type Arbor Support" that goes on a large ram and I have learned this is to support the outer end of the spindle when doing horizontal milling (hope this is correct!!). The smaller hole (.715") in the arbor support is a bushing on bearings-- and this, I think somehow supports the outer end (with the nut) of the other tool in the picture that is chucked in the spindle when horizontal. The tool that chucks into the spindle (with the nut on one end) has a one inch diameter with a keyway (.250").

I seem to be missing some pieces in this puzzle: 1) If a saw-type slot cutter is mounted on the one inch shaft-- shouldn't it have bushings on one/both sides to stabilize it along the shaft-- then tighten the nut on the end? If so, what are these called if I want to order some from a tooling supplier?
2) Some sort of shaft must go in the .715" hole in the Pilot Arbor Support to provide support to the outer end of the 1" shaft. The end of the 1" shaft looks like it takes a "center"/cone shaped tool that I am missing. What is this piece called and would a tool supplier have this or do I have to wait until I get a lathe and make one myself? (after I learn how to run a metal lathe!!

--Am I on the right track??
Thanks in advance,
Bob

 

[Reeltor]

I don't know much about the model 16; it looks like it takes a VN "C" taper. My 22l takes a NMTB50 taper and the end of the "A" type arbor is turned down to fit the hole in the Arbor Support.
I am attaching the accessories catalog, look at page 24 (page number printed on the page not the page number from the viewer) to see the model 16 arbor. If I had to venture a guess, I think the arbor that you have is not designed to use a arbor support.

 

[Bill C.]

Hi,
I'm new to milling-- have done some car/truck/farm repairs-- but just bought a Van Norman 16 mill last April and am finally getting around to getting it going and have made a few chips.
I'm trying to figure out how to set up the overhead ram support for horizontal milling:
--The picture shows the "Pilot-type Arbor Support" that goes on a large ram and I have learned this is to support the outer end of the spindle when doing horizontal milling (hope this is correct!!). The smaller hole (.715") in the arbor support is a bushing on bearings-- and this, I think somehow supports the outer end (with the nut) of the other tool in the picture that is chucked in the spindle when horizontal. The tool that chucks into the spindle (with the nut on one end) has a one inch diameter with a keyway (.250").

I seem to be missing some pieces in this puzzle: 1) If a saw-type slot cutter is mounted on the one inch shaft-- shouldn't it have bushings on one/both sides to stabilize it along the shaft-- then tighten the nut on the end? If so, what are these called if I want to order some from a tooling supplier?
2) Some sort of shaft must go in the .715" hole in the Pilot Arbor Support to provide support to the outer end of the 1" shaft. The end of the 1" shaft looks like it takes a "center"/cone shaped tool that I am missing. What is this piece called and would a tool supplier have this or do I have to wait until I get a lathe and make one myself? (after I learn how to run a metal lathe!!

--Am I on the right track??
Thanks in advance,
BobView attachment 110896

Try searching this web site; http://jmkasunich.com/vannorman/VN_M16.htm He has a photo of your support arm.

 

[Bob V]

Reeltor,
Thanks very much -- especially for the Van Norman Catalog of Arbor Accessories-- that was very helpful in identifying some of the other arbors I have as well as sorting out the one in the picture.
--I think you are right-- (my mill takes Van Norman "C" taper- also called 5V).
As you noted, on page 24 of the pdf you sent, the bottom arbor for MODEL 16, and this has the pilot end 23/32" -- my arbor in the picture does not have the pilot end.
Do you have any idea where I could find any of the pilot arbors for my machine listed at the bottom of page 24?
Also, since you have a VN mill do you happen to have the press-in Bijur oil sight glass inserts? A couple of mine are so dark I can't see the oil levels.
Many thanks.

Bill C.
Thanks-- I see the support arm pic, but I don't see the arbor that goes into it. BTW, unfortunately the guy that runs that website sold out last July-- auctioned off all the Van Norman parts he used to sell-- too bad.

 

[Bob V]

Reeltor,
A couple other questions: can you give me some idea how to order spacers for the shank arbors that I do have, and maybe where to order them from?
Do you have any other literature on Van Norman mills/accessories-- your last posted pdf was, as I said, very helpful.
Thanks again,
Bob
PS Forgot to include the pic of the Bijor oil site glass-- mine look like the middle one-

 

[Reeltor]

Reeltor,

As you noted, on page 24 of the pdf you sent, the bottom arbor for MODEL 16, and this has the pilot end 23/32" -- my arbor in the picture does not have the pilot end.
Do you have any idea where I could find any of the pilot arbors for my machine listed at the bottom of page 24?
Also, since you have a VN mill do you happen to have the press-in Bijur oil sight glass inserts? A couple of mine are so dark I can't see the oil levels.
Many thanks..

I don't know of a supplier of the arbors other than searching on Ebay. I too have dark sight glass on my mill, every once in a while, I will drain the oil into a clean stainless steel pot, measure it and put the correct amount back into the mill.
I did come across a supplier for the sight glass, let me do some searching.

For your arbor spacers, the trick is to find out what the suppliers are calling them.
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=477&PARTPG=INLMK32

This is from Enco, you can usually get a free shipping code and every once in a while a 15-25% off code too.
I think the arbor that you have is a stub arbor, because it looks so short. What does it measure and can you take some better photos? More detail, would help me at least see what you have.

BTW, better samples of the catalog and user manual for the VN16 can be found on Mr. Keith Rucker's Vintage Machinery site http://www.vintagemachinery.org/

 

[Bob V]

Reeltor,
Thanks again.
I've identified some of the arbors I have in the catalog you posted above- thanks. The one inch tool shank is about 3 1/2" long--maybe 4".
Here are some more photos of the arbor I was discussing when I started this thread--Is this a "Stub arbor" used for horizontal milling without the overarm support??
Can you tell me where I would use the "centers"? -- don't know if that's what they're called but they are collets with a cone on the end--

Bob

 

[Bob V]

New guy here-
Hope I didn't offend anyone with the above post----- I was getting great replies/info until I posted the above with the pics--no replies!!
Please help with the above post-- or tell me why someone is offended.
Thanks,
Bob

 

[Reeltor]

No offense taken, I didn't answer because I don't know the answer. Maybe Cal Haynes can chime in and give some insight.
It is my understanding that a stub arbor is not supported on the end. You can chuck it up in the spindle and then use it in either the vertical or horizontal position. Because it isn't supported I'd guess you couldn't take a huge cut in one pass. I don't have any (stub arbors) and will need to make some to hold saws etc. Many of us cant get into the site every day or even once a week so don't sweat not getting a quick response. If after a while you don't get a reply you may want to bump the thread up by asking for help

 

[JimDawson]

New guy here-
Hope I didn't offend anyone with the above post----- I was getting great replies/info until I posted the above with the pics--no replies!!
Please help with the above post-- or tell me why someone is offended.
Thanks,
Bob

If you don't get an answer, it normally means that nobody who has looked at your post knows the answer. Sometimes it takes a little time.

I don't know the answers to your questions either.
.

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