New Craftsman Lathe

[hukcats1]

Whilst I was working this weekend, my lovely bride scored a new metal lathe for me. What a woman! I have no idea what model Craftsman Metalcraft it is; I just know that it is at home in my garage for the low, low price of $150.00. Apparently, the old man that owned it took a shine to my lady. He originally wanted $300.00 (which I was willing to pay!) but she wasn't sure if I wanted it. When she left the sale, he told his partner that if she came back for it to give it to her for $150. Did I say that I love this woman?

So, be prepared for a lot of questions during the whole clean up phase. I don't intend to do a rebuild at this time, just a clean and lube then use.

 

[Mondo]

That lathe was built in 1935 or so. What you have is a 12" swing x 24" between centers. Single piece carriage/apron casting, 5/8" dia leadscrew, manual only cross feed and Zamak compund. EXACTLY what I had when I bought my first lathe. Mine lacked the switch in the electrical box, that had been dispensed with long before it came to me. Yours is historically correct for 1935. See this page: http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlas/ Third illustration down is a 10" version of your 12" lathe, having the verticle countershaft configuration vs the horizontal as yours.

I suggest you tear it down, sub assembly by sub assembly, piece by piece, clean throughly, lubricate and reassemble, painting as you go if you want it to look pretty.

If you want to seriously use it I suggest upgrading the saddle and leadscrew to gain advantage of power cross-feed (not terribly important but very nice to have) and an iron compound. At least get an iron compound - that Zamak compound is tender, weak, and a bit awkward to use.

Let me do some digging and I can point you to a thread where I show how I modified a 3/4" leadscrew so I could use a more modern carriage with power cross-feed.

BTW: That was a BARGAIN! Your wife is a real keeper. Don't let go!

 

[Don B]

Whilst I was working this weekend, my lovely bride scored a new metal lathe for me. What a woman!

Very nice, your lovely bride and the lathe are both keepers, I've always been lucky that way, my wife has understood and supported me with my tool obsession, have fun with your new lathe..!

 

[rferrara]

Its amazing what you can find at garage sales, It looks like you found a great deal with complete lathe and tooling, not to mention a great wife. about ten years ago i found a 1930 Southbend 9 inch lathe with a flat belt and motor at a garage sale. the guy wanted 150.00 and we got him down to 90 dollars, it was missing some gearing but works fine for me as Im not making space shuttles. now i have 3 different sized metal lathes and one milling machine. not to mention an shopsmith and 3 wood lathes, it never stops but make life interesting.

 

[wa5cab]

Howie,

Officially it is a 1936 model. The 1935 catalog only lists the 9". The model number should be 101.07380, What is the serial number? Should be stamped in the top of the bed right in front of the tailstock as shown in your first photograph.

I would be hesitant to make any changes to it. Although there are a few 9" around, it is likely the oldest Atlas/Craftsman 12" that's been reported either here or on the Yahoo Group. Putting later parts on it would be akin to dropping a Jaguar engine and gearbox into a complete unrestored Model A Ford. When you're done, you no longer have a Model A but you don't have a Jag either.

Robert D.

 

[hukcats1]

Thanks for all the information on the new lathe. This is my first metal lathe. I have been a wood turner for awhile, mostly pens. Unfortunately, I haven't had time to even look it over very well. I work 12-hour shifts and have been on shift since I got it home. I'll have a few days off in the middle of next week, so I'll have time to play with it. I don't believe I'll make any adds to the lathe. I just want to clean it, lube it and use it. I don't know enough about metalwork on the lathe to even know what's good and bad. Maybe a year or two down the road, between using the lathe and learning from you folks, then I can decide what I like and don't like about it. I do know that the person I bought it from was excited that my son and I get to learn on his old machine.

- Robert D., I'll get the serial number to you as soon as I get time to play with the lathe. On 12 hour shifts, sleep is the most important (after wife and kids!) thing on my agenda!

hukcats1 (h - for Howie, UK Cats #1 fan = hukcats1)

Howie

- - - Updated - - -

Its amazing what you can find at garage sales, It looks like you found a great deal with complete lathe and tooling, not to mention a great wife. about ten years ago i found a 1930 Southbend 9 inch lathe with a flat belt and motor at a garage sale. the guy wanted 150.00 and we got him down to 90 dollars, it was missing some gearing but works fine for me as Im not making space shuttles. now i have 3 different sized metal lathes and one milling machine. not to mention an shopsmith and 3 wood lathes, it never stops but make life interesting.

Sounds like a real sweet deal. Now the wifey has marching orders to find me a milling machine.

- - - Updated - - -

That lathe was built in 1935 or so. What you have is a 12" swing x 24" between centers. Single piece carriage/apron casting, 5/8" dia leadscrew, manual only cross feed and Zamak compund. EXACTLY what I had when I bought my first lathe. Mine lacked the switch in the electrical box, that had been dispensed with long before it came to me. Yours is historically correct for 1935. See this page: http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlas/ Third illustration down is a 10" version of your 12" lathe, having the verticle countershaft configuration vs the horizontal as yours.

I suggest you tear it down, sub assembly by sub assembly, piece by piece, clean throughly, lubricate and reassemble, painting as you go if you want it to look pretty.

If you want to seriously use it I suggest upgrading the saddle and leadscrew to gain advantage of power cross-feed (not terribly important but very nice to have) and an iron compound. At least get an iron compound - that Zamak compound is tender, weak, and a bit awkward to use.

Let me do some digging and I can point you to a thread where I show how I modified a 3/4" leadscrew so I could use a more modern carriage with power cross-feed.

BTW: That was a BARGAIN! Your wife is a real keeper. Don't let go!

I'll not be letting her go anytime soon, that's for sure! We've been inseparable now for over 36 years (other than those Navy enforced cruises!)

- - - Updated - - -

Very nice, your lovely bride and the lathe are both keepers, I've always been lucky that way, my wife has understood and supported me with my tool obsession, have fun with your new lathe..!

It is very nice when we have understanding wives, isn't it. I do believe I'll keep 'em both. I do intend to have fun learning on the lathe.

Howie

 

[Mondo]

I was not able to find the thread I posted somewhere else on changing my leadscrew so I posted that project in this forum.

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/showthread.php?t=22627&p=200389#post200389

That was done in 2009. Nothing in the major parts of the lathe were changed, no modifications to the bed, headstock, or tailstock. I can restore this back to it's original configuration is less than ten minutes because I kept the original carriage, leadscrew, and leadscrew bearing. The power cross-feed has been well worth the effort and expense of buying a newer carriage and all the apron parts that are required to make it work. Not only has this helped when facing off large diameter work, it has been especially useful when using the milling attachment because I can configure the gearing for very slow feed rates and make very smooth controlled cuts.

 

[Mondo]

Huk,

Officially it is a 1936 model. The 1935 catalog only lists the 9". The model number should be 101.07380, What is the serial number? Should be stamped in the top of the bed right in front of the tailstock as shown in your first photograph.

I would be hesitant to make any changes to it. Although there are a few 9" around, it is likely the oldest Atlas/Craftsman 12" that's been reported either here or on the Yahoo Group. Putting later parts on it would be akin to dropping a Jaguar engine and gearbox into a complete unrestored Model A Ford. When you're done, you no longer have a Model A but you don't have a Jag either.

Robert D.

Hello Robert:

As noted in my previous post I can restore my lathe back to it's original configuration in less than ten minutes. I kept the original parts and carefull packed them away for historic preservation. Changing the leadscrew and carriage is not permanent and no permanent modifications were required be made to anything but the worn 54" leadscrew I used. I don't have a model A with a Jaguar power plant.

(But by shortening the worn 54" leadscrew to use it on this lathe put the worn area too close to the headstock for the split nuts to engage that area so the worn section becomes irrelevent. And chopping that leadscrew has no impact on any historical significance to anything.)

BTW: to what 1935 catalog are you referring? The Atlas or the Sears?
As I am sure you know Tony Griffiths has a web site on which these lathes are well documented: http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlas/ Based on that web site and other documentation I have found my best guess is my lathe was manufactured after the 1934 10" model pictured on that page, but prior to the 1936 and 1936 1/2 modifications.

My 12" Craftsman has no ID plate with model and serial numbers. There is no evidence that one was ever mounted on it. Not on the back of the bed, either behind the headstock, midway on the back of the bed, or on the right end. No rivet holes, nothing. It has been my understanding that these lathes did not have an ID plate until Sears required that be added sometime in the late 1930's or early 1940's. It is also my understanding that there is no record or archive of the numbers stamped on the front way at the TS end and therefore not likely, if at all possible, to ID the manufacture date of a lathe based on these numbers. If you have information to the contrary I would love to hear it. Please share! The number stamped on the front way by the TS on my lathe is L6-860.

My lathe as received before I did any cleaning or rebuilding is pictured below. Though it came with the lathe, the lever operated turret tailstock is for a 10" lathe and would not work on my 12" unless I were to fabricate a 1" riser block. I had no interest in using the turret TS so it has since been sold. But because of where it is in the picture the bed foot on that end is not clearly visible. What can't be seen is that foot has only a single mounting pad on the end, no mounting pads on the front or back as at the headstock end, which hjas only two, one front and one back. This helps provide at least a clue to the year of manufacture. From the pictures and other documentation I have seen the earlier lathes had a smaller foot with mounting bolt provisions at front and back, then they increased the size of the foot keeping the two mounting holes, then for a year or so the right end foot had only the single mounting bolt at the end. This was before they made the much larger feet as seen under the 1936 model first pictured on Tony Griffiths page reference above.

 

[ddushane]

Nothing like a good woman that's on your side! God is Goood!

 

[wa5cab]

Spiral,

I've pointed out a few errors or possible errors on the UK site to Tony, some of which he said that he would correct. I've also told him that my research led me to disagree with two or three of the dates but haven't heard back from him on any of those.

As I've stated several times here, if I post a date based on spindle bearing date I say so or try to remember to. Otherwise, the date is based on the published catalog year. Since Atlas, until the new 12" models appeared in late 1957 and 10" production ceased, never published any catalog under their name showing a 12" and Sears never published any catalog showing an Atlas built 10", by default if the comment isn't based on a bearing date and applies to a 10" it is based on an Atlas catalog and if to a 12" on a Sears catalog.

I recently acquired the elusive 1935 Sears Power Tools Catalog, previously thought not to have existed. I have all of the known Sears Power Tools catalogs published between 1931 and 1982. I'm trying to re-correlate the catalog numbers with the known Model Numbers and may possibly adjust dates slightly. It's possible that your machine could be the one shown in the very small photo on the second page of the listings. Which does look like the one in the larger photo in the 1936 catalog as nearly as can be told. However, there is no evidence that the 9" style feet were ever sold under a 12". The only metal working lathe shown in either the 1934 Power Tools Catalog or the Big Book is the 9".

Atlas practice was to cast a part number into all castings large enough to hold one. No one has ever shown a stamped part number that I know of. So the conclusion is that the serial number of your lathe is 860. About the only thing that can be said about serial number prefixes or suffixes is that both Atlas and Sears seem to have been consistently inconsistent. The "L" plus single digit part number prefix seems to have applied to cases where the part for the 12" was different from that on the 9" or 10". But the digit(s) following the hyphen were usually the same as on the corresponding 9" or 10" part unless those machines did not have that part (the tumbler would be an example). Why they chose to prefix a serial number with a part number prefix I haven't the foggiest idea. But the bed part number at that time (for a 12x24) would have been either 942B or 942C. What I have pretty much concluded is that the serial numbers of the 12" models (unlike some of the 10") started at either "1" or at "100" when the first one was built and ran up continuously through the at least 16 known model numbers through sometime in 1957.

The main difficulty in calculating dates from serial numbers using known bearing dates and matching serial numbers is that we have no production data. It was apparently lost or discarded during one of the many moves that Atlas/Clausing made over the decades.

On the tailstocks, Atlas built three styles prior to 1958. The standard one with hand wheel driven ram feed screw was made in one size for the 10" and another an inch taller for the 12". Both used the same 10D-6 base and gib. The second type produced was the Turret Tailstock shown sitting on the bench in your photo. The main casting was used for both 10" and 12". The 10" version used the 10D-6 base. The 12" version used the 2" tall L6-6A. The third type was the lever operated tailstock which operates a ram similar to that on the basic version. The main casting is the same as that used on the turret version. I wish that Atlas had elected to use the same casting and two different bases on the basic tailstocks. I have both the turret type and the lever operated ram type but only have one base between them. I've had an auto search running on eBay for the past 18 months and none have turned up.

Robert D.