[Newbie] Help Me Evaluate Grinder Options.

[matthew-s]

Hi.

I'm a woodworker who is slowly getting into metalwork.

I have a current need to grind woodworking tools (hand plane blades, chisels, etc).

I'm also slowly getting an Atlas (actually Craftsman) 618 lathe, so I expect I'll need to grind HSS tooling.

If you were in my position, would you get:

1) Rikon 80-808 8" "low speed" grinder 1-2 hp 1750 rpm

2) Baldor 6" 600E grinder. 1/3 hp 3600 rpm.

3) A 2" belt grinder such as a craftsman or Dayton.

I don't see my interests expanding past woodworking and model engineering.

A little math shows that the Rikon grinds at 3663 FPM, the Baldor at 5652 FPM, and the Dayton at 4400 FPM.

For my purposes I view slower as better, but I can be persuaded.

All of these are "close enough" in price that is not a major factor.

If it matters. I'll probably use it in my detached (not temperature controlled) garage.

What would you pick and why?

Thanks.

Matt.

 

[mikey]

If you want a bench grinder just for tool grinding I would look at this site:

http://woodturnerswonders.com/collections/rikon-grinders

I have not personally used CBN wheels but I have looked at them fairly seriously and if I were to use a bench grinder for tool grinding, they are what I would go for.

With that said, I prefer a belt sander myself. A 2 X whatever (42, 48, 72) is a really good tool grinding machine provided you have a good tool rest and can install a ceramic glass platen liner. It will grind almost any metal lathe tool or wood turning tool and also do most general shop grinding, and it will do it quickly and cheaply. For new guys, a belt sander is easier to learn to grind turning tools on, at least IMO.

The little 2 x 42" belt sanders now sold by Sears, Palmgren, Grainger (Dayton) is a 1/3HP model. It is identical to the Craftsman 2 X 42 belt sander sold by Sears for about $165.00 or so. I own both the 1/2HP and 1/3HP models and can tell you that the 1/3HP is too weak. I can bog it down easily grinding a HSS lathe turning tool. The grinder itself is great in that it allows for fabricating a good tool rest and you can install a good platen on it but the motor is anemic. If you can find a used one and swap to a more powerful motor then I would jump on it.

 

[matthew-s]

Thanks. I'll check out the CBN option.

I have read your blogs on the belt grinder. Its what brought that option to my attention. For some reason the belt grinder seems like it would be easier to use.

It's too bad there is not a middle road option. There seems to be a big hole between the 200 and 450 price point when it comes to belt grinders.

What is your opinion on this? http://www.kalamazooind.com/products/belt-sanders/2fsm-2belt-sander/#sthash.IAdC4wjj.dpbs

After that it looks like you need to get a Coote, source a motor, etc.

Also too bad sears powered-down the model you recommend. I'd also rather not have to mod something like this. I was really hoping I could keep this < $300

 

[mikey]

The problem I see with the current line up of belt sanders is that the right side of the belt is not free and clear. Anything that obstructs the right side makes grinding back rake on a turning tool difficult. The edge of the platen has to be totally clear to fully grind a turning tool so the Kalamazoo, for me, is a no-go. It and the Coote are good grinders if it weren't for that. I'm not sure either can be modded to work but I haven't seen one in person so I'm not sure.

As crazy as it sounds, the Craftsman 2 X 42 is actually an intelligently designed machine at a good price. They are damned near impossible to find nowadays in the 1/2HP version. If you find one, grab it. I'm always on the look out for these things because they are simple to adapt a tool rest to and the platen is wide open and accepts a glass liner. If I do see another machine that does these things and is reasonably priced, I'll let you know.

There is nothing wrong with using a bench grinder so keep your options open. I used one for a long time and got to where I could grind almost anything on it. I just much prefer the belt sander for my own use.

 

[matthew-s]

This CBN option is starting to look better. Especially the lack of dust.

What kind of grit would you want for shaping lathe tools? I figure if it can grind a lathe tool, it will re-bevel a plane blade.

I have water stones, so I could use then to out on the final finish so long as the CBN was not too rough.

 

[mikey]

This CBN option is starting to look better. Especially the lack of dust.

What kind of grit would you want for shaping lathe tools? I figure if it can grind a lathe tool, it will re-bevel a plane blade.

I have water stones, so I could use then to out on the final finish so long as the CBN was not too rough.

I would call the guy and ask his advice. Intuitively, you would want the coarsest grit he sells for shaping. I would also want a sharp corner on the wheel instead of a rounded profile for lathe tools. Ideally, you would have a coarse wheel for shaping and a finer wheel for a finer finish but then it gets a bit expensive.

 

[Cheeseking]

I use my little kalamazoo 1x42 belt sander all the time. Nice for quicky jobs. Sharpens hss, lawn mower blades, good for deburring parts. Belt is fairly wide open and accessible. Works good on wood too. Highly recommended for general purpose stuff.

 

[mikey]

I use my little kalamazoo 1x42 belt sander all the time. Nice for quicky jobs. Sharpens hss, lawn mower blades, good for deburring parts. Belt is fairly wide open and accessible. Works good on wood too. Highly recommended for general purpose stuff.

Hey Cheeseking, can the belt be tracked over to clear the right edge of the platen? It also looks to be a bit tough to fit a good tool rest to it, unless you mount the rest to the platen maybe?

 

[Cheeseking]

I could be wrong but there's no hard mechanical adjustment for belt tracking that I am aware of. Black knob allows you to depress the upper pulley and lock down position to change belt. The upper pulley is crowned and pivots slightly under spring tension via the black vertical shaft. This keeps belt tracking nicely centered. I suppose you could tighten the knob to keep pivot locked. As far as the tool rest, it must have been lost in its prior life- I picked this up at an auction it did not have one. Been wanting to make one up but haven't got around to it. I'll have to look closer you cant see in the photo but pretty sure there are some existing tapped holes on the other side of the vertical gray metal bracket. For tool bits or things that need more precision I use the regular pedestal grinder. It has nice sturdy rests although I try not to use it much until I do up a dust collection system. (Yet another procrastinated project)

 

[mikey]

Okay, thank you. Yeah, a good tool rest is important. I just can't see any other way to mount it unless you use the side of the angle iron platen. I suppose you could fab something up, though. My main concern is if the belt could be tracked to clear the right side of the platen and it looks like that may not be possible. Thank you, I appreciate it.