End mill chatter?

don't ask me the exact running and feeds speeds cause I have no way of knowing what they are.

To me that sounds like a major part of the issue. I would not start lathe or mill work without knowing those.
Anything else is just guessing or trial-and-error......and both of those destroy too many cutting tools.
Perhaps some people can judge by experience, but after years of only occasional hobby work I sure can't.

so, maybe just not going fast enough? But that potentially seems like a bandaid.

In my book, going at proper speed/feed would not be considered a band-aid, but instead fixing the "root-cause" of the problem.

If you cannot find the manual at the Busy Bee site look for an identical machine on the Grizzly site.
http://www.busybeetools.com/pages/Manuals.html

Good Luck!

-brino
 
The dial on the mill only has 0-1500 on low and 0-2500 on high. So, it would be an educated guess based on the position of the dial. On the last run, I ran it at 1500.
I timed the power feed this morning then had to have my wife or the math, I couldn't sort it out in fpm since my table only has 7" of travel, amd really 6 are usable.
So, from what I can figure out, the chatter was probably running .020 doc, 900 rpm with a feed rate of about 0.7 fpm.
The smoother cut was around .015 doc 1500 rpm and the same 0.7 fpm.
The end mill is a 1/4" 4 flute roughing mill M42 Co8.
 
Might just get a stick of stressproof or 12L14 and make life easier. Personally , and its just my opinion, but unless I had at least 2 or 3 hp I would not fool with roughers, they are made to work, requiring a pretty good feed, and the rough surface teeth and a flexible mill set up do not lead to a happy situation. A nice fresh 4 flute endmill will likely suit you better.
 
I had tried to get some carbide end miles from a local tool supply but the ones I ordered (3/8") were no longer stocked. And I hadn't tried again. Because the mill is so small and usually when I'm working, later in the evening, cutting noise is an issue. So I had been trying to stock good quality cutters rather than chinese crap. Expensive!! I just haven't gotten there yet...
I'll call them again this week and see about some carbide or at least the cobalt end mills. I have a hss 1/2" and it just seems to get chewed up when I cut steel, and quite loud.
But 4 flute is the way to go with end milling?
 
In general 4 flute for steel, unless slotting. for a small mill that is not particularly rigid i would stay away from carbide in future, carbide is very hard and brittle, it does not give or flex much before breaking, I guarantee on a small mill you will have flex, not a good situation with carbide. BTW a half inch endmill is pretty good size for a small mill, you might be happier limiting yourself to endmills a bit smaller. No difference in sound level between carbide and HSS in my experience, certainly not dramatically. With smaller endmills, the cost of a mistake is much less. Rudy Kouhoupt did incredible machining , he used tiny equipment with small endmills.
 
Yeah okay, carbide out for me. I understand that. But the m42 Co8 ones seem harder than hss. And the price isn't way out there. I'd be happy with that.

I'm gonna set up a test tonight, gonna take the vise off, clean everything up real nice and use my DTI to see if I can detect any movement with each turn of the hand wheel, by hand and under power. The grooves I'm seeing look like they line up with each turn of the wheel.
 
I'm gonna set up a test tonight, gonna take the vise off, clean everything up real nice and use my DTI to see if I can detect any movement with each turn of the hand wheel, by hand and under power. The grooves I'm seeing look like they line up with each turn of the wheel.

yep that's good detective work to understanding what's going on.

Does a thread-pitch gauge line up to the machining marks?
If so, does that same measurement match your lead screw?

-brino
 
Ohh, that's a good idea! It would line up with the acme lead screw, if that were the case, wouldn't it... I don't have an acme guage but I can get close enough with the 60°
 
I'll offer an opinion, although there a lot of possible variables here. My first thought is that the end mill is dull or damaged. When I see a cut go from smooth to rough like yours did, without any of the cutting conditions changing, then it says to me that the end mill is toast.

We don't know the grade of steel you're working with so guessing about cutting speeds is just that, a guess. However, most common bolts in grade 5 are something like 1030 or 1040 steel so a cutting speed somewhere between 60-220 sfm would work, depending on your depth of cut. Roughing end mills like to run a bit faster than finishing end mills so take the high end and say that a cutting speed of 220 would work. This gives you an rpm somewhere near 3000 rpm for a depth of cut of about 0.02-0.04". So, for a 1/4" cobalt roughing end mill taking a 0.02" deep cut, I would suggest you increase your speed. For most cutters, the proper speed is more important than feed speed where cutter life is concerned. Quite often, you can just feel or listen to the machine as it cuts and get close enough to the right feed to get the job done. Roughers like to feed faster than finishing end mills, by the way.

Insofar as cutter material is concerned, I have used HSS, Cobalt and Carbide roughers on my Sherline mill and RF-31 and have no issues. Even my Sherline mill will cut well with these tools as long as I get my cutting conditions right. I use carbide tools when I need accuracy and stiffness in a deep cut, deep meaning a depth of cut the full diameter of the cutter, but cobalt is my go-to material for most stuff.

So, I would switch to a sharp rougher and see what happens. On a surface cut like you're doing, a 3-4 flute 0.025" finishing end mill will work as well or better but slow the speed a bit, say 2200 - 2500 rpm. If you feed manually, listen to the machine and feel for a slight resistance to feed and the end mill should walk right through a shallow cut.
 
Mike, you always have the best explanations.
That roughing mill is quite sharp.
I'll switch to high gear and try a few different mills and see what happens.
This was very informative guys. I think I have a much better direction now.
 
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