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Drill Chucks and Arbors

Discussion in 'MACHINE ACCESSORIES (Tables, Vises, Indexers)' started by Splat, Apr 14, 2017.

  1. Splat

    Splat Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    So what do you guys think is better, a drill chuck with an integral arbor or separate chuck and arbor? If it's from a renown company either way I would imagine should be ok, no?
     
  2. Bob Korves

    Bob Korves H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Separate arbor. If the arbor or the chuck gets damaged with the integral version, you throw the whole lot away. If you have a removable arbor, you can replace it, even with a completely different style. I also prefer straight shanks for use on milling machines, and they can be made to work on many other machines as well. You need less clearance to change tooling with a fairly short straight arbor in a collet. It will fit your next mill, even if it uses different collets.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
  3. darkzero

    darkzero Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Integral should have less runout & be more rigid. But that doesn't mean a drill chuck with separate arbor can't have low runout & a chuck shouldn't see side load anyway.

    Some keyless chucks with integral arbors don't have the collar that you can grip to tighten if/when you need it. On a lathe tailstock it's not needed. Some mills have a spindle brake or lock. My mill does not, I had an integral & eventually switched to a chuck with separate arbor cause I wanted the collar.

    Originally I went with the integral cause it's considerably shorter without the collar. I was worried that I might not have enough Z capacity sometimes but I've been ok.

    Downside with the integral is you can't ever change arbors if want to use the chuck for something else or if it needs replacement for some reason. Not something that bothers me but just thought I should mention it.
     
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  4. mikey

    mikey Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I prefer a separate arbor as well, mostly because they allow for more mounting options. However, Albrecht chucks with integral shanks are said to be more rigid and accurate, with better balance and improved headroom. They are also cheaper than buying a separate chuck and Albrecht arbor.

    I think the mount is less important than the quality of the chuck and arbor. When fitted well, an accurate chuck like an Albrecht will be just as accurate as an integral chuck or very nearly so. Of course, there is the human factor - some bozo hitting the poorly installed chuck with a hammer to align it and so on.
     
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  5. Tozguy

    Tozguy Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    It might also depend on the job. Chucks can and do come off the JT taper on the arbor under certain conditions. It only happened to me once but that was enough. The draw bar holds the arbor but not the chuck.
     
  6. Bob Korves

    Bob Korves H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I have an old Albrecht 5/8" drill chuck, needed rebuilding badly when I picked it up. Got that done, there were no real issues with the chuck other than incorrect lubrication, lack of care, and mild abuse. The cheap arbor that was on it was bad, and I bought a genuine Albrecht R8 arbor for it, ~$60 IIRC. It now has .001" runout at the jaws and .002" four inches from the jaws. Great drill chuck, cannot say enough good things about it. Albrecht arbors are the only way to go for a chuck you care about being accurate. Just take a deep breath and go for it! Well, not the only way to go, Jacobs N series ball bearing chucks, made in the USA, were also finely made and accurate.
     
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  7. mikey

    mikey Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Not to mention that if an Albrecht chuck ever spins on an Albrecht arbor, Albrecht will replace both for free, for life.
     
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  8. Bob Korves

    Bob Korves H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I didn't know that, Mike. Thanks, though I will probably never need the warranty...
     
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  9. Splat

    Splat Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Picked up a nice Bison 1/8-1/2" keyless chuck and now need a JT33-MT3 arbor. Surprised to see Albrecht doesn't make them. I would go with Jacobs but have heard their quality has gone downhill big time lately. Don't know how true that is but would rather go with another name brand...that I can find! I can't find anything but Jacobs and import.
     
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  10. mikey

    mikey Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Albrecht doesn't make them anymore but they pop up on ebay from time to time. The Jacobs arbors made in England are very good but you have to search for NOS on ebay. Other brands to look for - Rohm, LFA.
     
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  11. darkzero

    darkzero Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Nice, I also use a Bison chuck for my tailstock but it's a 5/8" cap.

    I used to have a Bison arbor on it but I needed to change it recently. I was going to get another Bison arbor but really IMO there's nothing special about them. They aren't even marked Bison or COO either.

    I just went with a Jacobs arbor. Like Mikey said NOS are made in England. I needed it the same day, $20 from MSC. I'm assuming China but mine doesn't say on it. My English made ones do say. I'll replace it later with something better but it's been fine so far.

    Ajax Tools sells the Bison arbors if interested. They have a listing on ebay.


    20170420_201044-800x574.jpg
     
  12. Splat

    Splat Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Thanks Will. From talking with the folks at Toolmex the older model numbers that start with a "7" were made in China. The newer numbers made in Poland start with an "8". MOF, I was told they are moving everything they can from China to Poland now. BTW, looks like Ajax is selling the China Bisons. I called Penn Tool the other day and the guy said they couldn't get the MT3/JT33 Toolmex/Bison arbor I needed. For the heckuvit I called today and spoke to someone else and he said they can indeed get it, and it'll be drop shipped right from Toolmex. Sweet.
     
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  13. darkzero

    darkzero Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Thanks, that's good to know about the P/Ns. Yeah I heard TMX was moving all their production to Poland. I assumed it was just for chucks though, didn't know it was for tooling also. Sounds good. Please keep us updated when you get it. I would like to get one too.
     
  14. Splat

    Splat Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    A little early since I don't have the arbor for it yet but just an inspection of the Toolmex/Bison chuck looks good. Really smooth action and no nicks inside on the arbor mating surface. I'll do a run out test when I can.
     
  15. EmilioG

    EmilioG United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    The Albrecht MT arbors are very rare indeed. I found my MT2.JT arbor, after searching for over a year. The Albrecht MT shank integral chucks are nice
    if you want a dedicated chuck for your lathe, and they do pop up on Ebay frequently.($$$$$). I have a few Jacobs USA and England arbors, NOS, that I found
    on Ebay super cheap. The vintage Jacobs arbors usually come in a green cardboard tube, but be careful on Ebay. I've seen sellers list an Import arbor with a
    a vintage box or an Albrecht container. P.S.: ETM and Lambrich make decent arbors and like Mikey wrote, the vintage Rohm arbors are pretty good. (new Rohm arbors are all made in Taiwan now). Do a search on Ebay and get email notifications for your MT3/JT33 arbor. Ya never know.
     

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