Clausing 4914

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Hello all,
A little background first. I am the proud new owner of a Clausing 4914 Lathe. This is my first metal lathe. I've never even run one before. I am however a skilled woodworker and own a small wood lathe, so I'm not exactly new to working with machines and problem solving. I have been reading several machining message boards for a while now, joined the Clausing yahoo group, and have downloaded every pertinent manual, document, and file I can get my hands on. I've also already contacted Clausing Industrial to get as much info out of them as possible. I've also read all the info I can get on inspecting a used lathe.

With all that being said, I inspected the lathe yesterday and decided it was worth the very low price that man was asking. My limited experience tells me the head stock and the bed ways are both in good condition. The current owner ran it under power to show me it has forward, and reverse, and despite a broken QCGB handle the lead screw does engage. It is missing the handle for the tail stock clamp as well. In my opinion the machine just needs a good dose of TLC. Until I get it home for a cursory cleaning I don't think I'll be able to decide if I'm going to do a complete tear down and re-furbish ala Kennyd, or just a very thorough cleaning ala PurpLev. So I plan on using this thread as a way of querying you guys for as much info you are willing to lend throughout the process.

Which brings me to my first problem. Getting it home. I own a Dodge Dakota pickup. The shop I bought it from has a forklift and could easily put it right into the back of my truck, however I don't believe I can easily get it out of there once I get it home. I've been slowly developing a plan and I wanted to run it by some people with experience moving these machines.

I am going to rent the smallest U-haul trailer that can handle the weight so that the lathe will be low enough for me to unload. I was going to lay down two 6x6 timbers on the trailer so the seller can lower the lathe with the forklift right down onto these runners. I'd then lag the lathe down to that. Can someone tell me what size the holes are through the leveling feet so I can get the right size lags and washers? I've got plenty of ratcheting tie downs to hold the lathe down. I can back up the trailer right next to the door to my shed. I bought a HF 2 ton shop crane and have several lifting straps. I plan on hoisting the crane up and driving the trailer out. I should be able to maneuver the crane around so that I can lower the lathe onto the sidewalk leading to the door. There is a slight, call it 2" step up into my shed. I'm thinking I'll have the runners long enough so that when I lower the lathe the tips of the runners will be able to reach through the door above this ledge. I can put down steel pipes as rollers under the leading edge. I have a pinch bar that I can then start using to lever the lathe onto the rollers, probably with the help of the crane on the end that's still out of the door.

Sounds like a lot of work but I think I'll be prepared. Any tips on exactly where to place the lifting straps so to not damage the machine? I know you should run them under the bed NOT the chip tray but I don't know anything else.

One downside of the low price is this thing doesn't come with ANY tooling whatsoever. So I'll have some forthcoming questions on tool posts and chucks.

Also as the motor is 220 3phase I'm looking into setting it up on a Teco FM50 VFD. This may sound crazy but my shed does not have permanent power and I currently run a 6" grizzly jointer and a 13" Dewalt Planer off of an extension cord from my apartment. Will this be an issue with this machine on the above mentioned VFD?
 
Welcome to HM :HM1:


I am short on time so my reply will have to be brief for now, key points:

-lathes are very top heavy, you should really consider taking the bed off of the stand to move it. You also won't need the trailer if you do this

-the fm50 will need 220 volts input, do you have that available? What HP motor does it have?
 
Kennyd,

I toyed with the thought of ditching the trailer and removing the bed from the base after seeing your photos. How quickly can you disassemble it enough to do that? I'm not sure the seller wants to hang around while I struggle with taking it apart in his shop. It would save me a bit of money and hassle not to have to rent a trailer though. The ultimate benefit would be that I would have much more manageable pieces when I go to unload it as well.

I hadn't realized the FM50 required 220V. I'll only have 110V available. The motor is 1 HP. Is there a VFD that can operate that size motor off of 110V?

Thanks for the input.
 
Until a few months ago I would say "I'm envious of that lathe" ;)

Congrats, and welcome to THM, and Clausing.

I would have to differ with Kenny. and while lathes are indeed top heavy in general, the 4900 are less so than others as they are smaller, and their bases are heavier compared to the heads (in comparison with other heavier lathes 16"+ where the bed+head is heavier compared to the base). I moved mine on a trailer some 300 miles away without bolting it to anything (used 3 straps) and while this was risky to some, it did survive the cross state trip safely and as such required minimal disassembly/work initially.

I think you can pass a 1/2" stud through the leveling/anti-vibration feet. and if you already have the user manual for the lathe it is actually mentioned there (don't have it in front of me at the moment, but if you don't have it I can look it up later).

Other than that, I think the trailer + 2Ton lift will work well and will require you for minimal work during the moving process which has enough time consuming steps to it. once you have the lathe in your place, you can take your time taking it apart as you see fit without a time limit. thats my take on it.

As for tooling. Other than steady rest, everything else can be found and managed with the chucks being the hardest to come by because of the threading, but you can get a plain back chuck, and mount it to a pre threaded plate which can be found for these lathes in several online suppliers, the cheapest I've found was at amtools.com - just make sure they have it in stock as they are not the most responsive at times.

As for the FM50 - not all models require 220v INPUT, I am using FM50-101 which runs on 110v 1ph INPUT and 220 3ph OUTPUT. these are only good for motors up to 3/4HP though, since yours is a 1HP it will require 220v INPUT. Is there any way to wire electical outlets in your garage? sounds like this might be worth it with your machinery and plans long term.

Good luck, and looking forward to seeing this one cleaned up and put to use
 
PurPlev,
I think I'm still leaning in that direction. Your words are encouraging. I've been going through the motions of this delivery in my head over and over and I think I've tweaked a few minor things to make it a bit easier. The important part is I have every step planned out and know what I want to do. Sadly, all my friends think I'm crazy for buying such a heavy piece of equipment and none of them are willing to help me. So it looks like I'll be doing this move on my own.

Thanks for the link on the back plate. They don't have the correct threads listed on any of their products but you are right, they seem to be pretty low cost. I sent them an email to see if they can get that size. It will be a while till I'll actually have this thing up and running but I'd like to start keeping my eyes open for something that might work.

I tend to be a frugal person while at the same time respecting the cost of a well made tool. However when I look at the price of a Buck or Bison chuck my jaw drops. What are you guys using on your 4900s? It looked to me like you lucked out and your lathes had chucks when you bought them.

I found this site which lists a backing plate in the right size, however from the features and specifications it's not clear if this is a backing plate or a chuck. I think it's a backing plate and they have screwed up the description. But it seems very expensive compared to amtools.com http://www.travers.com/product.asp?r=s&q=item_id+'63-500-481'

I'd imagine I'd have to get the chuck first to know what bolt pattern I need as well. Is that correct?

As far as the VFD goes, I'm going to have to immerse myself into that technology so I can figure out what I can and can't do. Unfortunately I am in a rental apartment and running power out to my shed is not really the easiest option. If I wanted to do it legitimately I'd have to first get my landlord to agree to it and then hire an electrical contractor to do the work. I could physically do it myself, but I'd be doing it without the consent of my landlord and without a building permit so that could get squirly fast. It's not really a garage, its more of a storage shed where I keep my lumber supply. Less than ideal obviously but its what I have to work with. I'd love to find an empty industrial space but real estate in this town is pretty ridiculous.
 
Do you have any photos or a list of exactly comes with your machine? I can't imagine the seller keeping things like chucks since they are pretty machine specific.

How far are you going to get this lathe?

The VFD Charley linked looks perfect for your situation.

I see you are in DC, I am less than 1.5 hours from you. I may have any extra chuck I could set you up with...
 
np.

I mostly used the 3 jaw scroll chuck that came with the lathe as it was simple to use, but now got a 4 independent jaws chuck that I can dial in which I prefer to use for precision work, and I also got an ER collet chuck for yet even better precision which I am in the midst of setting up with a back place.

I actually got a 6" back plate from the link I mentioned above for the clausing 4900 spindle at 1-3/4"x8tpi from them. the plate they didn't have in stock was a 3" one for the ER collect chuck that I had to fabricate with another back plate I recently got.

I'd also be curious as to what DOES come with the lathe. I've seen some lathes being sold 'bare' and stripped of all toolings (chucks included) but am hoping you'd get at least a chuck, and a center? (hopefully more)

if you need a tool post - I have a lamp post with some tool holders that I got with my lathe I could set you up with (I'm using an PhaseII AXA tool holder myself.
 
Exactly squat comes with this machine. No chuck, no tool post, no centers. From what the seller tells me, a few years ago his shop had bought several used lathes and mills planning on expanding their capabilities, needless to say I think they ended up shrinking instead of expanding, as did a lot of places in the last few years. Am I falling for a sob story? Did they start parting this lathe out before I came along? Who knows. I'm not the best at reading people but I don't think this guy is trying to pull a fast one on me. There was a "faceplate" that was on the lathe when I looked at it, but sadly I didn't notice if it was actually a faceplate or a chuck backplate. I'll have to see what it was when I pick the lathe up.

I'm not totally naive in that I do know that tooling can cost as much as the lathe. I got what I consider to be a very low price on the lathe. With the money I have left over I can pick up enough tooling to get working. I'll probably go the secondhand route for most of it and be patient since it will probably be a while till I can actually run this thing anyway. I've been waiting 11 years to get a metal lathe, so its not like waiting a bit longer is going to kill me.

PurPlev, I'll have to check their site again, I was looking for a 5" thinking I'd pick up a 5" 3 jaw scroll chuck first and get a 6" 4 jaw later. Now it might just depend on what comes up first. So you find that you use the 3 jaw more, and throw on the 4 jaw when you need to be more precise?

How do you like the Phase II? I'd love to get an Aloris but unless I come across a very discounted one I don't think I can afford one. I may take you up on the lantern post, we'll have to see what I can pick up between now and getting the lathe running.

Kennyd, I'm travelling about 2 hours to PA to get it. It's very close to where I grew up, and close to my mom and my sister's house so it's not that inconvenient to me. Yeah, I noticed you were in MD not that far. Again, depending on what I can find between now and when Ig et this running I may take you up on that chuck offer.

You guys on this board are very kind for offering such things. I'm glad I joined.

Thanks again for all your help.
 
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