• This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn more.
  • Guest,  We want to wish You and Your Family a Healthy, Happy Thanksgiving! Click the "X" at the top right corner to remove this notice)
  • PLEASE: Read the FORUM RULES BEFORE registering!

4

Bonding ABS Pipe

3
Like what you see?
Click here to donate to this forum and upgrade your account!
10

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#1
I know this is not really a metal working item but indirectly it is. I am trying to build a metal storage rack out of black ABS sewer pipe. The problem is that the regular yellow ABS cement does nothing. I even tried straight MEK and straight acetone with no success. The annoying thing is that in the recent issue of HSM a guy says he did just that- built an ABS storage rack and bonded it together with ABS pipe cement. When one glues an ABS coupler to an ABS pipe you have about 5 seconds to get it all correct otherwise a sledge hammer will not break the bond. Not if used externally apparently.

I figure with the wide range of experience of the membership here someone will be able to direct me to some solvent that will melt ABS pipe.
 

ttabbal

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Messages
68
Likes
44
#2
So, are you using fittings? You really should if you want to use normal pipe cement. It also provides rigidity and gives everything time to set up.

If it's really ABS, acetone will dissolve it, but it takes a while. You could try a trick from the 3D printing world.. Take a jar you can seal up, pour acetone in, then drop in some ABS bits. Smaller parts dissolve faster. You can drop a few couplers in and let it sit overnight, shake it here and there, etc.. Makes a heck of a glue for printed ABS anyway.

Keep in mind, solvent welding is much like metal welding or soldering. You have to keep the parts securely clamped until the bead cools. The solvents take minutes or hours to flash off though. That's where the fittings are handy. The taper acts like a clamp.

I don't use ABS pipe much, but I have done a ton with PVC. It's much the same. If it's the time issue, dry fit and mark a line, then when you apply the cement you have the witness mark to use for alignment. Makes that 5 seconds seem like an eternity.
 

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#3
Sorry, I should have made this clearer. I am wanting to bond them edge to edge so I can stand them up and slide rods, flat bar, hex or angle into the top of them for storage. Ordinary ABS cement does not soften the material enough to bond them.
 

RJSakowski

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2015
Messages
2,769
Likes
2,838
#4
I have done butt joints using PVC/ABS cement. I used to make battery holders for AA cells from PVC by adding an end cap to PVC tubingand weldng the tubing to a PVC plate. the It requires some patience though. The cement will soften the base material but it takes some time for the solvent to diffuse out of the joint area. It will eventually harden.

You might try using the primer instead. I believe that the solvent used evaporates faster. Adding ABS chips will give it some body as ttabbal suggested.
 

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#5
Thanks, RJ. I looked for primer the other day but our local purveyor of plumbing needfuls didn't have it. Might be worth a try. I can see if ABS actually melts in a jar of solvent and if so use that.
 

RJSakowski

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2015
Messages
2,769
Likes
2,838
#6
In my experience, the welded bonds are not as strong as the parent material. You can peel welded joints If you can incorporate mechanical fasteners to prevent the lifting process which precedes the peel, that would be beneficial. If you are making vertical storage, seven pieces fastened together in a hexagonal pattern would be quite stable. A couple of large strap clamps would help to keep them honest.

I use sing;le pieces of 4" Sch. 20 pipe for vertical storage. I welded an end cap on and it serves quite well. If you wanted to stack some together, you could weld the end caps on and cut away the contact area between tubes. to make a tight stack.
 

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#7
Yeah, RJ, I agree. But why is that when they are capped they have incredible strength? Like I say you can't break them apart with a sledge hammer. But when they are a side by side bond they have the strength of egg shells. I stumbled across a whack of this ABS pipe so it is free. Steel pipe would be easier but tres expensive. I have made a rack that surrounds it on all sides for the bottom tier. Then they are stepped up for shorter pieces and finally stepped up again with 2" pieces for shorter stuff. 'Twould be nice if they could just be glued together as the step up and back.

There must be some solvent on this earth that will cause ABS to melt.
 

ttabbal

Active Member
Active Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Messages
68
Likes
44
#8
The fittings work for a couple reasons. They clamp the parts together, and they keep the solvent in contact longer before flashing off. In air, that stuff flashes fast. Between fitting and pipe, it takes long enough that it gives things time to melt together. There's also a larger contact area.

You might try taking a couple scrap parts, glue between them, then clamp them together securely for an hour or more. Something like a ratchet strap should work fine. A couple bar clamps, etc.. See if that helps. Some ABS dissolved in might help with the evaporation problem as well.

Another option would be to use cross fittings and short pipe parts to connect the racks together. Takes more space though.

Another thing from the 3D printers.. Get some samples of ABS printer filament, chuck it in a dremel, and friction weld them. Or use another heat source and it would be a bit like torch welding.. I wouldn't use a torch though, perhaps a soldering gun?
 

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#9
So I just cut off a slice of ABS pipe and put it in a jar with acetone which is supposed to be an effective solvent for it. We'll see.
 

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#10
TT, I agree. I think the solvents evaporate too fast in open air. I have clamped these things every which way and it makes no difference. I have also sanded the gloss of the pipes and drizzled more solvent into the joints. All to no ev
fact. And yet the HSM article says he used ABS plumbing cement....
 

brino

Active User
H-M Supporter - Sustaining Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2014
Messages
2,844
Likes
2,618
#11
Another thing from the 3D printers.. Get some samples of ABS printer filament, chuck it in a dremel, and friction weld them.
Great idea, thanks for posting that!
I had one of those "spin welder" bi-plane kits when I was a kid. One year that was all I really wanted for Christmas.
-brino
 

David S

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2012
Messages
1,039
Likes
678
#13
Is it possible for you to post a picture of what your desired outcome is?

David
 

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#14
Aliva, I used to do heat fusion years ago. Cool concept but kinda needs expensive equipment. The pipe once butt welded this way can be run over with a D9 Cat and they won't break. Side wall fusion is tougher to do.

David S, I'll try to post some pix.
 

Fitter Bill

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
39
Likes
13
#15

Allan

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
188
Likes
10
#16
Fitter Bill, that looks like it might work. I'll see if my local emporium can snag it for me. I was thinking that maybe I should run a belt sander over it or it over a belt sander to get more surface area on it. Maybe I can run it over my wood working jointer????
 

DHarris

H-M Supporter - Premium Member
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2016
Messages
99
Likes
88
#17
Just a question - - - do they NOT make a specific joint for connecting two pipes together for ABS pipe (like for pvc pipes)? Seems like that is the simplest and strongest bond you could possibly get?

edit: Thanks kd4gij, just re-read thread - - - darn, there goes a few more brain cells and iq points!)
 
Last edited:

silence dogood

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jul 10, 2013
Messages
329
Likes
178
#18
How old is your solvent? And have you used that same glue on other jobs. I have found that the solvents especially the PVC will go bad if its been opened for earlier glue-ups and gets thick. I've found that it is better to bite the bullet and buy a fresh can.
 

kd4gij

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2011
Messages
3,982
Likes
1,249
#19
Just a question - - - do they NOT make a specific joint for connecting two pipes together for ABS pipe (like for pvc pipes)? Seems like that is the simplest and strongest bond you could possibly get?

I think the OP is trying to bond them side by side Not end to end.
 

Hawkeye

Active User
H-M Supporter-Premium Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2011
Messages
1,769
Likes
399
#20
I have made quite a few things out of ABS sheet and a few with pipe, using methylene chloride. If you have a plastics supplier in your area, you might be able to get a small supply. Use it in a ventilated area. It melts ABS quite quickly and sets up in a short time. Also works on plexiglas.
 

umahunter

Active User
Active Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2014
Messages
414
Likes
133
#21
Are you using black abs cement because yellow is for cpvc it won't bond abs cement it isn't the right chemical makeup
 
6
5 7