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5C Chuck vs 5C Lever Style Collet Closer

Discussion in 'GRIZZLY INDUSTRIAL INC.' started by jjtgrinder, Feb 21, 2017.

  1. jjtgrinder

    jjtgrinder JJTGRINDER H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I am looking at a tru-set style 5C Collet Chuck sold by Lathemaster and trying to determine if that would be better or less desirable than a 5C lever style collet closer. I have a G4003g lathe.

    Please reply with pros and cons of each.

    Thank you
     
  2. BGHansen

    BGHansen United States H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I have a lever style on my Grizzly G0709, %-C chuck on my Clausing 5418 and a draw-tube style 4-C on my Rockwell 10".
    More experienced guys will add to the lists, here's my opinion/experiences:

    Lever style Pros:
    Quick removal, insertion of stock into the collet. Flip the lever, slide material in the collet, flip it back and you're tight and ready to go.
    Accuracy - best. The 5-C collet adapter is directly mounted to the spindle taper. Stack up to the part is spindle to adapter to collet to work.

    Lever style Cons:
    On mine collet changes are a bit of a pain. Lots of turns on the back side collar to loosen/remove a collet. I made an adapter to spin the draw tube with a cordless drill to speed up the process.

    Chuck Pros:
    Relatively quick removal, insertion of stock in the collet (not as quick as the lever style). Works like a 3-jaw or 4-jaw, turn the key enough to slide the material in/out of the collet to position, turn the key to lock it in.

    Chuck Cons:
    Maybe less accurate than lever style. Stack up is spindle to chuck mounting adapter to chuck collet interface to collet to work. If you have a set-tru style collet chuck, it may be more accurate than the lever style.
    Really slow collet changes. Mine takes around 20 full turns of the key to remove a collet. I made an adapter out of the 1/4" hex to 3/8" square socket adapter to speed things up.

    Draw tube Pros:
    For my Rockwell, it's the most accurate. There is not spindle adapter for this lathe (4-C collets go directly in the spindle); stack up is spindle to collet to work.
    Pretty quick stock removal; turn the back side hand wheel a half turn, give it a pop on the end to push the collet out of the spindle, position the work and turn the hand wheel again. Not as fast as the lever style, but quicker than the chuck since you don't need to grab another tool before doing the move.

    Draw tube Cons:
    Slow collet changes. I usually turn the hand wheel and pop the back side to loosen the collet. Then grab directly on the collet and start unscrewing it.

    Regardless of which one you get, you will be pleased. I work a lot with aluminum and brass, never a mar on the surface using a collet. It's really nice to take work out of the collet and go back later and have it well under 0.001" off center. My main lathe is a Grizzly G0709, but the Clausing 5418 gets a lot of use too. I leave a 3-jaw on the G0709 and a collet chuck on the Clausing.

    Bruce
     
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  3. mksj

    mksj Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I previously had the LathMaster 5C Tru-Set chuck, it worked very well and held much better tolerance than the standard direct mount Sino ones (which I had to return because the TIR was so bad). The nose on my LatheMaster was out a bit relative to the 5C collet mount surface being true, so I trued it up but it did not affect its performance. The gearing on the LatheMaster collet screw is pretty quick for changing collets, I use a speed handle to speed up collet changes. As Bruce nicely outlined there are plus and minuses for different 5C systems. One comment is that if you do a lot of repetitive parts, a lever style is quicker and the reproducibility of holding a part is probably better. Using a collet stop in my LatheMaster 5C to do repetitive work, I had up to a 0.002" length variation depending on how tight the part cinched down into the chuck.

    A few other individuals use LathMaster 5C Tru-Set chuck and have liked it, and use it frequently for holding stock under 1". So I would recommend it, unless you want to pay 2-3X more for a Bison depending on the version. I would expect a good lever style 5C to be more expensive then the LathMaster 5C Tru-Set chuck. The only other alternative is there are 5C holders (like the Kalamazoo - 5C Collet Chuck) that mount in your 3J or 4J chuck, the latter one could set the TIR but a bit cumbersome if switching back and forth. They are also more expensive then the LatheMaster chcuck and you might have more angular deviation depending on how they are clamped in the chuck.
     
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  4. jjtgrinder

    jjtgrinder JJTGRINDER H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Thanks guys!!!

    I'm going with the Lathemaster set-tru model.
    I'll get an adapter plate and modf it.

    I don't relish the conversion to make a lever type work on my G4003g. (Like the fine job BGHansen did).
     
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  5. FLguy

    FLguy H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I have that unit, very nice but many turns required to get collet in or out. Lever types are great if you can fit to your lathe which isn't possible some times so check before you buy a lever. With that said I wish I had a lever style.
     
  6. jjtgrinder

    jjtgrinder JJTGRINDER H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I don't do a lot of repetitive work
     
  7. Silverbullet

    Silverbullet Active Member Active Member

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    If your going to use collets and if it fits your lathe the lever works the fastest. Collet chucks were made for LATHES that the lever didn't work on.
    Personal choice and funds usually are the deciding factors.. I have had a lathe with the lever type it was made to work quickly and accurately. My logan will be set up with a lever type , I have everything I need now to install it . Chucks are fine , my choice is lever. Good luck with which ever you choose. For holding small diameter materials there great. Thin wall tubing another item .
     
  8. Doubleeboy

    Doubleeboy Active User Active Member

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    I have set tru Bison, Lever Hardinge, cheapo chinese done up to homemade setru back plate and a Hardinge speed chuck, all in 5c, the Hardinge speed smokes em all for speed, the bison is the **** for close tolerance repeatability. Atlas now makes a clone of the Hardinge type speed chuck, but its about a grand. Ebay is your friend for used Hardinge Sojourn chucks. There is almost nothing to wear out on a speed chuck except the outer ring which you grab with hand, I like the all aluminum, but some guys like the plastic covered ring.
     
  9. mksj

    mksj Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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  10. jjtgrinder

    jjtgrinder JJTGRINDER H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Thank you all, great deal of good info!
     

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